8th Feb 2011, 17:43
permalink Post: 1182
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by
dmussen
I am looking at my office wall in Fremantle, Western Australia at a photograph of G-BOAC after getting airbourne on its maiden flight. It is signed by my work colleges at Brooklands.
|
In my case it's a pic of G-BSST, signed by colleages and friends at Fairford.
Has been hanging over my desks in France for over 35 years, and hasn't really bleached yet.... good quality colour print....
Quote:
| Somewhere in a trunk I have a copy (blueprint) of prototype 01 notated in both English and French. |
And yes, most are annotated in both French and English, both the descriptive legends and the measurements (i.e., metric and 'imperial').
CJ
9th Feb 2011, 02:34
permalink Post: 1184
More About Happy Days.
Great to hear from folk involved with this beautiful work of art (and engineering).
I tried to find that blueprint of the general arrangement of 01 but that trunk in my Garage has a lot of stuff in it.
My memory is not what it used to be and brake parachute indeed makes sense. Spinning one of these aircraft would not have been an option.
I did manage to get on board G-BOAC in the hanger at Filton and was permited to walk out onto the port wing wearing felt overshoes. When I saw that leading edge at close quarters I was stunned. Never got to fly the aircraft but once saw one over the Bristol Channel when I was in a Folland Gnat. He was climbing when I decided to take a closer look. Needless to say this was an exercise in futility. Not a hope in hell of catching him but still a wonderful sight.
Cheers.
I tried to find that blueprint of the general arrangement of 01 but that trunk in my Garage has a lot of stuff in it.
My memory is not what it used to be and brake parachute indeed makes sense. Spinning one of these aircraft would not have been an option.
I did manage to get on board G-BOAC in the hanger at Filton and was permited to walk out onto the port wing wearing felt overshoes. When I saw that leading edge at close quarters I was stunned. Never got to fly the aircraft but once saw one over the Bristol Channel when I was in a Folland Gnat. He was climbing when I decided to take a closer look. Needless to say this was an exercise in futility. Not a hope in hell of catching him but still a wonderful sight.
Cheers.
17th Apr 2011, 04:37
permalink Post: 1299
She was a a test airframe only, although in circa 1985/86 we did look at modifications that would bring her up to production aircraft standard. The modifications required to the powerplant alone (mainly engine and intake control logic and management) were truly massive, as well as other things like engine instrumentation and other systems' control management. The total cripler however was the cost of a TOTAL RESKIN of the forward fuselage section (Component 30, made at Brooklands). The production series aircraft had a thicker skin here, and we were told that the CAA insisted on this being done as part of any conversion to airliner standard. Costs of around \xa330 were being banded about for bringing the entire airframe up to production aircraft standard. Also of course she had an MEPU when flying rather than a HYRAT for emergency power and of course a large flight test observers position.
I worked on 202 personally quite a bit during the mid to late 70's, but she never remotely 'felt' like a real production aircraft. Even aircraft 204 (G-BOAC) in her pre-route proving days was a radically different beast. (The OAC post route-proving modifications although at system level were quite extensive, these were miniscule in comparison to the differences between 202 and what we like to call 'the REAL Concorde'. Don't get me wrong, 202 did some absolutely stirring work in terms of route-proving and certification trials, and the restoration done at Brooklands is most impressive indeed, but she is and always was, nothing other than a test aircraft. She was no more a production airframe in reality than the pre-production aircraft 102, and I'm afraid that anyone thinking that she is anying other than this is truly deluding themselves my friend.
I'm sorry if this reality is dissapointing steve-de-s, but if you want to see a Concorde that is truly representative of what the aircraft was really all about I suggest that you pop up to either Manchester or East Fortune. (The only airliner museums in the UK now open to public viewing). The Manchester exhibit in particular is truly superb and beautifully kept by some great people, and shows you exactly what Concorde, THE AIRLINER was actually like, rather than just seeing a test specimin. (A superb specimin 202 indeed she was, but this is ALL she ever was, a test specimin).
Best regards
Dude
I worked on 202 personally quite a bit during the mid to late 70's, but she never remotely 'felt' like a real production aircraft. Even aircraft 204 (G-BOAC) in her pre-route proving days was a radically different beast. (The OAC post route-proving modifications although at system level were quite extensive, these were miniscule in comparison to the differences between 202 and what we like to call 'the REAL Concorde'. Don't get me wrong, 202 did some absolutely stirring work in terms of route-proving and certification trials, and the restoration done at Brooklands is most impressive indeed, but she is and always was, nothing other than a test aircraft. She was no more a production airframe in reality than the pre-production aircraft 102, and I'm afraid that anyone thinking that she is anying other than this is truly deluding themselves my friend.
I'm sorry if this reality is dissapointing steve-de-s, but if you want to see a Concorde that is truly representative of what the aircraft was really all about I suggest that you pop up to either Manchester or East Fortune. (The only airliner museums in the UK now open to public viewing). The Manchester exhibit in particular is truly superb and beautifully kept by some great people, and shows you exactly what Concorde, THE AIRLINER was actually like, rather than just seeing a test specimin. (A superb specimin 202 indeed she was, but this is ALL she ever was, a test specimin).
Best regards
Dude
Last edited by M2dude; 17th Apr 2011 at 07:09 .
23rd Apr 2011, 09:13
permalink Post: 1316
CliveL
(And ChristiaanJ)
Sure can Clive. These are the BA 5102 numbers, Air France 5101 numbers were corespondingly identical chronologically.: G-BOAC - 5102-01. G-BOAA - 5102-02. G-BOAB - 5102-03. G-BOAD - 5102-04. G-BOAE - 5102-05. Although G-BOAG (G-BFKW) and G-BOAF (G-BFKX) were originally Variant 192 (British Unsold) aircraft, these correspondingly became 5102-06 and 5102-07. I wonder if anyone here remembers G-BOAF doing her pre-delivery flying at Filton registered as G-N91AF? I remember when I was at Filton doing one of my Concorde type courses in 1980, and there was good old Foxy Lady with her 'Branniff' registration. She was
re
-re-registered
to G-BOAF prior to delivery to BA.
The Component 30 skin thickness issue was not relevant for
RELIFE 2
; you and I know that the major 'skin' issue here was the centre fuselage crown area. The issue of Component 30 was a 201/202 issue only. (Assuming that the French had the need/desire/capability of adding another airframe to their fleet.
And sorry everyone about the \xa330 cost of converting 202 into an airliner, I meant (dumb ass that I am) \xa330 MILLION.
Best regards
Dude
Quote:
| Dude, can I join Christiaan in requesting more information on that '5000' series numbering; I have never come across it before. |
to G-BOAF prior to delivery to BA.
Quote:
| Also, I have asked the CAA surveyor who was most likely to have made that reskinning decision for more data. Perhaps he can remember the problem with the forward fuselage skins. Certainly when we were standing together inside 102 last week and talking about fuselage modifications for relifing the aircraft the problem of Component 30 was not mentioned! |
And sorry everyone about the \xa330 cost of converting 202 into an airliner, I meant (dumb ass that I am) \xa330 MILLION.
Best regards
Dude
28th Jul 2011, 08:15
permalink Post: 1410
Dem Kullerz
Glad the Filton AF guys enjoyed their Concorde fix. (There is no other Concorde in the UK, bar none, that able to achieve this fix better than G-BOAC can
). As far as the gear door colours go, well the 'normal' colour is the light brown one that you describe, the green primer colour door is a replacement one. (As to when we did that replacement I really can't remember I'm afraid - Extreme Brain Fatigue
).
I'll have a closer look at that door when I'm next up in Manchester in 10 days.
Best Regards
Dude
). As far as the gear door colours go, well the 'normal' colour is the light brown one that you describe, the green primer colour door is a replacement one. (As to when we did that replacement I really can't remember I'm afraid - Extreme Brain Fatigue
).
I'll have a closer look at that door when I'm next up in Manchester in 10 days.
Best Regards
Dude
13th Aug 2011, 12:00
permalink Post: 1427
Filton
Save Bristol\x92s Concorde and the Brabazon Hangar
The Brabazon Hangar dominates the south side of Filton Airfield. During the 1960s it became the home of the UK Concorde production line, but Concorde wasn\x92t the first aircraft to be built within this amazing structure.
The hangar was originally built during the 1940s to enable the construction of the massive Bristol Aircraft Company\x92s type 167, which is better known as the Brabazon and hence this is where the name of the hangar came from . This giant airliner aircraft had a 230ft wingspan, and was powered by eight pair-coupled Bristol Centaurus piston engines and was Britain\x92s attempt at a non-stop trans-Atlantic airliner.
The prototype flew in 1949 six years and \xa33 million after the conception, and sadly the aircraft was already obsolete. The British de Havilland Comet jet-powered airliner was already well on the way and on the other side of the Atlantic, Boeing were developing their 707, and both of these would fly faster and carry more passengers than the Brabazon The prototype flew for a short while and a second turboprop-powered prototype (Brabazon II) was being built when the project was abandoned. Both aircraft were subsequently broken up in 1953.
With the demise of the Brabazon project Bristol was then left with one of the largest aircraft production facilities in Europe and therefore the giant Brabazon hangars were put to other uses, these included being used for the production line for the much more successful Bristol Britannia airliner.
But the Brabazon hangar has become more famous today as the birthplace of all the British built Concordes, ten airframes were built there, one prototype known as 002, one pre-production known as 01, one development production known as Delta Golf, and of course the seven airliner production airframes detailed below\x85
G-BOAA
G-BOAB
G-BOAC
G-BOAD
G-BOAE
G-BOAF
G-BOAG
Concorde 216 G-BOAF was the last Concorde built anywhere in the world, and of course the very last one to fly in November 2003. During her final flight she flew back to her birthplace, to Filton to form a major part of a new planned Bristol aviation museum. The plan was to house the whole of the Bristol Aviation Collection, known as the BAC, in one building, a centre to celebrate Bristol\x92s incredible aviation history, and let\x92s not forget that Bristol led the world.
But like so many things in this fast changing world, ideas and directions soon change and as in this case not for the better.
Heritage Concorde has heard of one idea that it wishes to push forward with anyone who would be willing to work alongside the group. With next years closure of Filton airfield, one incredible heritage building stands at risk of being ripped down and lost forever, the Brabazon Hangar. So why not use this building as the centre of the history of Bristol aviation and space industry, and in memory of the man who started it all, Sir George White. It\x92s large enough to form one of the most incredible museums in the world; it would be able to house the whole BAC collection with Concorde 216 at the centre, where she was built.
This idea needs to be looked into and not dismissed so easily by the people leading the effort for the new museum. Heritage Concorde will start to develop this idea further.
Any ideas, any offer of help or advice???
Steve de Sausmarez
The Brabazon Hangar dominates the south side of Filton Airfield. During the 1960s it became the home of the UK Concorde production line, but Concorde wasn\x92t the first aircraft to be built within this amazing structure.
The hangar was originally built during the 1940s to enable the construction of the massive Bristol Aircraft Company\x92s type 167, which is better known as the Brabazon and hence this is where the name of the hangar came from . This giant airliner aircraft had a 230ft wingspan, and was powered by eight pair-coupled Bristol Centaurus piston engines and was Britain\x92s attempt at a non-stop trans-Atlantic airliner.
The prototype flew in 1949 six years and \xa33 million after the conception, and sadly the aircraft was already obsolete. The British de Havilland Comet jet-powered airliner was already well on the way and on the other side of the Atlantic, Boeing were developing their 707, and both of these would fly faster and carry more passengers than the Brabazon The prototype flew for a short while and a second turboprop-powered prototype (Brabazon II) was being built when the project was abandoned. Both aircraft were subsequently broken up in 1953.
With the demise of the Brabazon project Bristol was then left with one of the largest aircraft production facilities in Europe and therefore the giant Brabazon hangars were put to other uses, these included being used for the production line for the much more successful Bristol Britannia airliner.
But the Brabazon hangar has become more famous today as the birthplace of all the British built Concordes, ten airframes were built there, one prototype known as 002, one pre-production known as 01, one development production known as Delta Golf, and of course the seven airliner production airframes detailed below\x85
G-BOAA
G-BOAB
G-BOAC
G-BOAD
G-BOAE
G-BOAF
G-BOAG
Concorde 216 G-BOAF was the last Concorde built anywhere in the world, and of course the very last one to fly in November 2003. During her final flight she flew back to her birthplace, to Filton to form a major part of a new planned Bristol aviation museum. The plan was to house the whole of the Bristol Aviation Collection, known as the BAC, in one building, a centre to celebrate Bristol\x92s incredible aviation history, and let\x92s not forget that Bristol led the world.
But like so many things in this fast changing world, ideas and directions soon change and as in this case not for the better.
Heritage Concorde has heard of one idea that it wishes to push forward with anyone who would be willing to work alongside the group. With next years closure of Filton airfield, one incredible heritage building stands at risk of being ripped down and lost forever, the Brabazon Hangar. So why not use this building as the centre of the history of Bristol aviation and space industry, and in memory of the man who started it all, Sir George White. It\x92s large enough to form one of the most incredible museums in the world; it would be able to house the whole BAC collection with Concorde 216 at the centre, where she was built.
This idea needs to be looked into and not dismissed so easily by the people leading the effort for the new museum. Heritage Concorde will start to develop this idea further.
Any ideas, any offer of help or advice???
Steve de Sausmarez
16th Sep 2011, 14:45
permalink Post: 1456
Hi Philflies
The 3/4 tab mounted by the #4 EGT indicator had in fact nothing to do with the EGT indication at all. It wasa reheat capability indicator and was set by the crew prior to take off. Set to 4 meant that all 4 reheats were required for take-off (and if one failed it then meant that the take-off should be rejected). Set to 3 it meant that a single reheat failure could be tolerated and the take-off could continue.
I hope this helps Philflies.
Oh and check out the website BRINGING CONCORDE G-BOAC BACK TO LIFE - Welcome The fat lady aint singing yet. Also check out the Concorde comes alive thread here too.
The 3/4 tab mounted by the #4 EGT indicator had in fact nothing to do with the EGT indication at all. It wasa reheat capability indicator and was set by the crew prior to take off. Set to 4 meant that all 4 reheats were required for take-off (and if one failed it then meant that the take-off should be rejected). Set to 3 it meant that a single reheat failure could be tolerated and the take-off could continue.
I hope this helps Philflies.
Oh and check out the website BRINGING CONCORDE G-BOAC BACK TO LIFE - Welcome The fat lady aint singing yet. Also check out the Concorde comes alive thread here too.
Last edited by M2dude; 16th Sep 2011 at 17:21 .
17th Sep 2011, 12:27
permalink Post: 1457
UPDATE UPDATE
It seems that the Concorde comes alive thread has been deleted. This is such a shame, I tried as hard as I could to keep things civil but others hijacked it again, just as the original thread was. Perhaps we may be allowed to post points about G-BOAC in Manchester here, I do hope so because it is such a fascinating story and is a story still being told.
22nd Nov 2011, 21:53
permalink Post: 1489
Well if South Ken want to get rid of that 593, we'll give it a home in our building next to G-BOAC.
28th Nov 2013, 22:28
permalink Post: 1757
Quote:
| How was the aircraft operated for base training? I imagine it was a 'rocket-ship' with no payload and little fuel. |
My one and only Concorde flight (G-BOAD) was Manchester to Paris via the Bay for 60,000 feet and M2. I was lucky enough to be in the jump seat for the entire flight so didn't suffer 'small window' limitations! My most memorable view was about 50,000' over South Wales looking through the windscreens. The whole of SW UK was visible on that glorious August day in 1999, with the scattered occasional cu looking as if they were on the ground! The bright yellow of the beaches around the coasts of Wales and England stand out in my memory, as well. As do other aeroplanes flying west-east very far below us!
At 60,000' the sky was amazing - dark blue fading to very dark overhead. And of course the curvature of the Earth clearly visible.
Despite flying interesting aeroplanes for well over 30 years myself, that flight in AD is a magnificent highlight I will never forget!
For those who want to sit in the P1 seat and try out those lovely cabin seats, come and see our G-BOAC at Manchester!
20th Feb 2014, 09:54
permalink Post: 1786
Thanks Clive, I did wonder why the static ports near the doors used those plates.
I'll look for a photo. If I can't find one, I'll take one next time I'm with G-BOAC (next week).
There are others as well, as in the pictures below (but these are not the ones I'm referring to):
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=co...%3B3912%3B2599
I'll look for a photo. If I can't find one, I'll take one next time I'm with G-BOAC (next week).
There are others as well, as in the pictures below (but these are not the ones I'm referring to):
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=co...%3B3912%3B2599
Last edited by Shaggy Sheep Driver; 20th Feb 2014 at 10:18 .
18th Jun 2015, 17:01
permalink Post: 1901
leb001
,
While it's a nice pic, the artist has been taking a fair amount of artistic liberties....
For instance, the door located at the forward end of the wing, just forward of the emergency exit, is pure fiction.
The tail is something between proto and production.
As said, the registration is a few paint smears, and does not correspond to anything real.
AFAIK , G-AXDN (01) never had a British Airways livery.
I'd suggest the picture could have been inspired by DG, or SA (but in that case the BA livery is on the wrong side), or one of the production aircraft delivered to BA in the period that livery was used (such as G-BOAC).
I would consider it as a generic British Airways Concorde from the early days. I don't think there was an attempt to carefully depict one particular aircraft.
Hope this helps!
While it's a nice pic, the artist has been taking a fair amount of artistic liberties....
For instance, the door located at the forward end of the wing, just forward of the emergency exit, is pure fiction.
The tail is something between proto and production.
As said, the registration is a few paint smears, and does not correspond to anything real.
AFAIK , G-AXDN (01) never had a British Airways livery.
I'd suggest the picture could have been inspired by DG, or SA (but in that case the BA livery is on the wrong side), or one of the production aircraft delivered to BA in the period that livery was used (such as G-BOAC).
I would consider it as a generic British Airways Concorde from the early days. I don't think there was an attempt to carefully depict one particular aircraft.
Hope this helps!