June 12, 2025, 10:34:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11898938
Subjects
AI171
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June 12, 2025, 11:04:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11898987
That very much sounds like the RAT is deployed as the aircraft goes by the camera.
Subjects
RAT (All)
RAT (Deployment)
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June 12, 2025, 11:24:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899028
That very much sounds like the RAT is deployed as the aircraft goes by the camera.
Hard to say and the noise could be a fake. It's hard to tell what's real these days.
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RAT (All)
RAT (Deployment)
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June 12, 2025, 13:03:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899131
https://x.com/akku92/status/1933114664923148455?s=46
https://x.com/akku92/status/1933114664923148455?s=46
I can\x92t say what link there would be between the commercial equipment not working and what could cause such a catastrophic loss but I submit this to greater minds than mine
I guess it\x92s also worth saying Air India\x92s renovation plans for their legacy wide bodies has fallen behind repeatedly (apparent supply chain issues) with the first only due to go into the shop by the end of this year (it was meant to be much earlier) so IFE issues on some of the first Dreamliners ever to enter service may not be related at all
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June 12, 2025, 13:16:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899150
interestingly he also seems to have been around to witness the TO roll and is mentioning a possible EFATO:
Subjects
EFATO
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June 12, 2025, 15:16:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899259
Can't post links yet but user is Lakshmiitata27
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June 12, 2025, 15:21:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899260
x.com/Snehalsays_03/status/1933167491192398224
(cant post links yet)
Last edited by Senior Pilot; 12th June 2025 at 19:23 . Reason: URL
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June 12, 2025, 16:14:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899322
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June 12, 2025, 16:44:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899373
That very much sounds like the RAT is deployed as the aircraft goes by the camera.
This is a higher quality video posted earlier. That is not two engines at TOGA and sounds incredibly like a RAT. I think most commenting about not hearing a RAT are watching the more widely shared low quality vid with very poor sound.
Subjects
RAT (All)
RAT (Deployment)
TOGA
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June 12, 2025, 16:48:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899382
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RAT (All)
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June 12, 2025, 16:51:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899390
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June 12, 2025, 16:54:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899392
note: engines seem awfully quiet. RAT clearly audible
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RAT (All)
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June 12, 2025, 16:59:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899403
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June 12, 2025, 17:33:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899447
is it possible to set slats only for take off on the 787/boeing? For the Airbus we will get 1(slats)+F (flap) on the ground when selecting flap position 1
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June 12, 2025, 18:22:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899503
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June 12, 2025, 19:11:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899556
Subjects
MAYDAY
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June 13, 2025, 03:34:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899935
So, if such an untestable circumstance were to happen to a competent crew and they were to inadvertently shut-down the wrong engine (and then/were in "clean-up mode":
a. The residual hyds would break the downlocks - but not retract the gear (and it would appear to be still selected down)
b. The alternate flaps might start to retract (gear downlocks not being now "made") once selected, but the slats remain out.
c. the RAT would deploy
The point at which all thrust ceases (and the climb vector flattens/reverses) is easily seen
in the video shot from the 6:30 clock position from about a km away. It's readily apparent.
An engine failure just off the runway after V1 in a fully loaded 787-8 in high ambient temperatures would assuredly have a crew thinking about a "toute suite" shutdown of a misbehaving donk. That's human nature. When the PERF is quite sluggish you will be thinking that a quick clean-up of the situation is certainly called for. That's just human nature unfortunately, particularly when you are under the time compression of dire circumstance (and the airframe is performing like a lame dog, just due to the environmentals and the early failure). I think that what the pilot reportedly said to ATC in his Mayday bears that out as being his instant mindset (quite clearly). Been in that "fools rush in" circ myself. You just have to "sit on your hands" and fly the beast.
But then again, if the RAT was NOT found deployed, then it's a case of the right seat mistakenly sucking in the flaps and slats... and that will do it... whatever the power/TOGA might be.
https://tinyurl.com/4zzkeeud
Rotation +33s
Mayday call +44s, circa 300 ft altitude (ADS-B)
Peak altitude +49s, 625 ft (Flightradar24)
Impact +58s, crash site 1.6 km from runway
Last edited by bbofh; 13th June 2025 at 08:53 .
Subjects
ADSB
Dual Engine Failure
Engine Failure (All)
FlightRadar24
MAYDAY
RAT (All)
RAT (Deployment)
V1
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June 13, 2025, 12:38:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11900394
At 20 seconds he describes the aircraft being "stuck" which I think refers to a sinking or "not climbing" feeling. He then goes on to say that some lights flashed - green and white. He says that bit in English.
Subjects: None
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June 14, 2025, 01:49:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11901040
Furthermore, the engines cannot run from the center tank. There's no such thing. The center tank transfers to the outer tanks, when necessary or when running low or to resolve imbalances, either automatically or manually initated by the pilot for whatever reason. The engine fuel pumps only ever draw from their respective tank.
It is as thus impossible for the center tank being empty to cause engine shutdown unless the main tanks were also empty, in which case we would: be in a lot of trouble, shouldn't be taking off, and wouldn't have a massive orange fireball.
https://kb.skyhightex.com/knowledge-...7-fuel-system/
Can you state the source of your information? I have no way of independently verifying what I've provided. According to that, however, the two center tank pumps are higher pressure than the L/R tank pumps and will override them if both are activated. So the center tank fuel is used first, then the L/R tank pumps. If no pumps are operating, the engines can suction fuel from their respective L or R tanks provided there's enough atmospheric pressure. The end result is still that an empty center tank cannot cause an engine shutdown absent some other malfunction.
Subjects
Centre Tank
Engine Failure (All)
Engine Shutdown
Fuel (All)
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June 14, 2025, 03:51:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11901095
Please verify the videos using the links below, so we know we are all talking about the same thing. I deliberately avoid any judgment regarding theories posted thus far - I am merely supplying information against which you can further test those theories.
1. Primary eye witness video with audio:
[ X link ending 1933089931347345596 in case the hyperlink itself doesn't work for any reason]
- Footage starts with aircraft directly overhead, give or take, (based on both sound & vision)
- 13 seconds from start until fireball clearly visible above roofline
2. Airport CCTV:
[X link ending 1933162059556159903 ]
- 49-50 seconds until impact and fireball clearly visible
Subtract the 13 secs noted in video #1 and this establishes the approximate moment the aircraft passes over the video witness's position when viewed from video #2 (CCTV):
49 - 13 = 36 secs into video 2
Estimated timeline (CCTV #2):
19s: rotate
31s: climb rate noticeably deteriorates (12s after TO / 18s from impact)
36s: estimated moment aircraft overflies eyewitness camera (17s after TO / 13s from impact)
38-40s: pitch up then descent begins (19-21s from TO / 9-11s from impact)
49s: first contact with ground (30s after TO / approx impact)
50s: fireball visible above rooftops
Conclusions from combining both videos:
- Aircraft overflies eyewitness camera roughly 13 secs before impact
- This is well after it has stopped climbing (~6 secs)
- This is also mere seconds before CCTV shows the aircraft pitch up and start to descend (which I believe I can substantiate in the eye witness video, although this is tougher to confirm with the naked eye from this viewing angle - someone may have to look more closely than I can this evening!)
- I have previously asked questions about the audio in video #1 and whether we can draw any conclusions regarding RAT deployment & engine thrust. There are strong opinions on both sides. Your personal view on this will influence your evaluation of what the videos show, but either way your theory needs to fit the timeline (or advance a different one).
So, anyone who is developing a theory ought to consider whether it is consistent with the following:-
- rate of climb decays to 0ft/m within 10-12 secs of rotation
- RAT (possibly) audible within 17s of rotation *
- pitch up shortly afterwards with no discernible increase in engine noise & unable to arrest descent
- impact with ground within 30 secs of rotation
* I recognise that the RAT deployment is not an established fact, but any theory that proposes RAT deployment needs to take into account this timeline in addition to the rest.
Alternatively, you are welcome to refute this simplistic, late night analysis of the limited video evidence.
Subjects
CCTV
RAT (All)
RAT (Deployment)
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