Tu.114
June 12, 2025, 10:24:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11898928

The video seems to show the aircraft descending from a few 100ft altitude to an impact. The landing gear appears down, flaps are harder to make out.

How does a 787 react to low speed? What are the protections on this type?

Subjects: None

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skysod
June 12, 2025, 10:24:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11898929

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DogTailRed2
June 12, 2025, 10:32:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11898936

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tu.114

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3SEjNFJU6M

The video seems to show the aircraft descending from a few 100ft altitude to an impact. The landing gear appears down, flaps are harder to make out.

How does a 787 react to low speed? What are the protections on this type?

Not video, shows a live feed?

Subjects: None

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Porto Pete
June 12, 2025, 11:24:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899028

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt2725

https://x.com/krok7517100/status/1933089931347345596

That very much sounds like the RAT is deployed as the aircraft goes by the camera.

The noise certainly matches " target="_blank"> The noise certainly matches

Hard to say and the noise could be a fake. It's hard to tell what's real these days.

Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment)

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drdino
June 12, 2025, 11:37:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899041

Comparing the sound at the beginning of this video:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ahmedabad/s/Oz5hQzDiu5

With the sound of the 787 at the 1:14 mark

It sounds like it had the RAT deployed?

Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment)

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fdr
June 12, 2025, 14:37:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899220

Quote:

Originally Posted by Porto Pete

The noise certainly matches

Hard to say and the noise could be a fake. It's hard to tell what's real these days.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViceSergal

[img]image.jpg[/img]

Pixelation is a bit absurd, but that looks a bit like a RAT to me in the lower right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CW247

Just for the record, there is no system on modern Boeing aircraft to prevent the accidental retraction of flaps when too low or slow when airborne. You wouldn't even get a warning on Boeing aircraft that is related to Flaps, you'd eventually get one related to Low Speed or Stall. The Airbus has a safety feature called "Alpha-Lock" which physically stops the Flaps from moving when the AoA or speed? is deemed too low. But that's not a safety net for all flap settings, just the lowest for takeoff. It will save the day in 95% of situations though Mr Boeing (hint hint)

Takeoff config warnings and checklists may not have helped if the flap setting was not enough given the weight and conditions. A good handling pilot could recover from an incorrect flap setting (providing there's no obstacles to deal with), by gently lowering the nose allowing the airspeed to build up before resuming the climb. However, various human factors such as startle and over reliance on automation (my thrust setting must be good) will not help the situation.

In order of likelihood:

1.) Flaps moved instead of gear
2.) Incorrect Flap settings and inability of crew to recover from that
3.) Double engine failure
4.) Some electrical event that distracted them

TE Flaps are extended, flap gaps between the wing and the flap element are observable. This is not an aberration of the spoiler position, you can see the nacelles through the gap, and that means the flap can not be in the retracted position.

An error of the TE flap deployed position, say between flaps 5 or 15 is not going to cause a stall event.

The flap has not been retracted instead of the gear.

Double engine failure... India. birds, always a latent threat. No rudder deflection, no aileron deflection, so it's not a SE problem, any engine issue is affecting both engines.

Pitch control and roll is not compromised in the video. The crew put out a mayday, not sounding like an electrical fault or distraction.

any funerals near by?

Incorrect TO thrust setting would not present in the video as recorded. Low thrust results in low acceleration, and extended distance to rotate. after rotate, low thrust results in low climb rate, and can result in the crew over pitching where the aircraft has obstructions that the crew have to avoid. the video appears to show the pitch increasing at a point where the aircraft is already unable to climb, not the other way round. An outside possibility.

For survivors, any from the aircraft will be a miracle, and mainly from the rear of the plane near door 3 area, if any. Plane is still striking tank traps at 70m/sec +, high ANU, it's not a high survivability event. Occupants in the buildings along the flight path will have a high fatality rate as well. This is going to be a high toll event in the aircraft and on the ground. Bad day at VAAH. RIP.

Last edited by fdr; 12th June 2025 at 18:24 .

Subjects Dual Engine Failure Electrical Failure Engine Failure (All) Human Factors MAYDAY RAT (All)

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Iron Duck
June 12, 2025, 16:30:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899343

Although the CCTV video is of unfortunately low resolution the trailing edge discontinuity between flaps and aileron can just about be seen on the port wing at about 3/4 span, just as it can in this video at around 54 seconds in:

Looking at the original video again the equivalent discontinuity is just about perceivable on both wings, so I was wrong at first and the flaps were not retracted. What appears to be the RAT quite possibly is; at that angle the nosewheel is completely hidden by the fuselage.

Subjects CCTV RAT (All)

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Arrowhead
June 12, 2025, 17:01:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899406

Quote:

Originally Posted by SloppyJoe

This is a higher quality video posted earlier. That is not two engines at TOGA and sounds incredibly like a RAT. I think most commenting about not hearing a RAT are watching the more widely shared low quality vid with very poor sound.

RAT theory plausible IMHO

Subjects RAT (All) TOGA

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Old Boeing Driver
June 12, 2025, 17:59:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899474

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantz

Not in Paris region. Habsheim, in Alsace. An air show, you're correct. With the brand new A320.

Air France 296Q

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mikeygd
June 12, 2025, 20:48:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899674

I've been looking at all the posts all day but don't think anyone has mentioned this.
Anyone struggling with the videos on twitter/x or other sites that has Youtube can see them on VASAviation. He also explains the runway length/ADSB tracking on the ground issue .

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slacktide
June 12, 2025, 21:54:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899723

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sriajuda

You have heard AC with the RAT deployed HUNDREDS of times? The RAT is a last resort, when all other power sources have failed. All engines, the APU and (possibly) batteries on AC as the 787. Yet you have heard hundreds of RAT deployments passing overhead? Yeah, sure.

There are people in the world who have a different, less limited lived experience from you.

As noted in my profile, I live in the Apple Maggot Quarantine area. Specifically, I live in Lynnwood, Washington directly under the approach path for Paine Field's runway 34 Left, and I've been there since 2007. I lived in Mukilteo from 2000-2007, which is more next to the runway than under it. I also own and operate a small aircraft based at Paine Field and am outside on the ramp at least every other day. Boeing manufactures the 777 and 787 at Paine field. Two thousand, nine hundred and fourty-six of them have been made since 2000, when I moved here. The RAT is deployed and tested during EVERY SINGLE first flight of every aircraft Boeing produces that has a RAT installed. And sometimes it requires a re-test on subsequent flights.

So yeah, I have heard a deployed RAT, from the ground, HUNDREDS of times. I've heard it while preflighting my airplane, I've heard it while mowing my lawn, I've heard while lying in bed. And this is exactly what they always sounds like. Another poster compared it to the sound of a T-6 Texan, which is really quite similar. You can find dozens and dozens of videos on YouTube of aircraft landing at Paine Field with the RAT out. It's not rare, it happens daily.

Last edited by Senior Pilot; 13th June 2025 at 02:08 . Reason: Remove abuse of another member

Subjects APU RAT (All) RAT (Deployment)

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CurlyB
June 12, 2025, 22:01:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899731

Quote:

Originally Posted by slacktide

You are ignorant, and you are rude. There are people in the world who have a different, less limited lived experience from you.

As noted in my profile, I live in the Apple Maggot Quarantine area. Specifically, I live in Lynnwood, Washington directly under the approach path for Paine Field's runway 34 Left, and I've been there since 2007. I lived in Mukilteo from 2000-2007, which is more next to the runway than under it. I also own and operate a small aircraft based at Paine Field and am outside on the ramp at least every other day. Boeing manufactures the 777 and 787 at Paine field. Two thousand, nine hundred and fourty-six of them have been made since 2000, when I moved here. The RAT is deployed and tested during EVERY SINGLE first flight of every aircraft Boeing produces that has a RAT installed. And sometimes it requires a re-test on subsequent flights.

So yeah, I have heard a deployed RAT, from the ground, HUNDREDS of times. I've heard it while preflighting my airplane, I've heard it while mowing my lawn, I've heard while lying in bed. And this is exactly what they always sounds like. Another poster compared it to the sound of a T-6 Texan, which is really quite similar. You can find dozens and dozens of videos on YouTube of aircraft landing at Paine Field with the RAT out. It's not rare, it happens daily.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDZJYpe0uL8

Thanks for your input and a reminder to others manners cost nothing! You don't know who you're speaking to

Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment)

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krismiler
June 13, 2025, 01:30:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899865

Here's another YouTube presentation.

Similar to the Emirates crash following the attempted go around in DXB, momentum can be converted into altitude until speed runs out and gravity takes over.

Quote:

Yes. But I have not flown this scenario in the sim. Way too many protection to take off without proper configuration which leads me to believe loss of lift due to flap retraction. 1100 hr FO ……..
Quote

On the Airbus, if we take off in anything other than 1+F, I'm watching the F/Os left hand very carefully when I call for flap retraction.

Last edited by Senior Pilot; 13th June 2025 at 02:29 . Reason: Both videos have been online here for many hours. Please read the thread

Subjects: None

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Sisiphos
June 13, 2025, 01:53:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899881

Quote:

Originally Posted by krismiler

Here's another video taken from a different angle.
https://youtu.be/2zi0HHGA4Ak?si=j3lVInUt1BFPQQZ8

Similar to the Emirates crash following the attempted go around in DXB, momentum can be converted into altitude until speed runs out and gravity takes over.

On the Airbus, if we take off in anything other than 1+F, I'm watching the F/Os left hand very carefully when I call for flap retraction.

If it was inadvertant flap retraction then they would have lived had it been an Airbus ( alpha floor prot, slats don't retract etc)

My 2 cents: this accident will be a catalytic event.

It will soon come to light pilots crashed a 100% working aircraft. Boeing and Airbus will present a near automatic airplane as a consequence very soon.

This accident will be the gravestone for the handling ( and thinking) pilot.

Last edited by Sisiphos; 13th June 2025 at 02:08 .

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A Low End Private Pi
June 13, 2025, 04:47:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899965

RAT Close-up

Close-up of the RAT

Subjects RAT (All)

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simon001
June 13, 2025, 05:37:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11899986

Probably the best, early stage theory of the the cause that I have seen as yet. By a current 777 captain:

Cutting to the chase, just watch between 11:00 and 12:05.

1. "Positive rate"

2. "Gear up"

3. Then the pilot not flying reaches for the flaps .

If you watch the whole thing, the guy looks at two other possible causes but then discounts them. He makes the call based upon an analysis of the video.

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lakedude
June 13, 2025, 10:04:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11900214

Quote:

Originally Posted by simon001

Probably the best, early stage theory of the the cause that I have seen as yet. By a current 777 captain:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7EZkungFEE

There is evidence on this thread that flaps were not the issue. The Mayday call and the evidence that the RAT was out is more convincing than a gear/flap mixup. Early on in this thread the gear/flap mixup had a lot of traction but after more photographic evidence surfaced it has more or less been put to rest, for me anyhow.

Subjects MAYDAY RAT (All) RAT (Deployment)

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xetroV
June 13, 2025, 14:11:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11900504

Video evidence suggests at least the leading edge devices were extended:

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smith
June 13, 2025, 15:14:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11900553

Just remembered this video of a787 with its RAT deployed. You can certainly hear it. A lot of people said you could hear it in the AI video but I couldn\x92t.

Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment)

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nolimitholdem
June 13, 2025, 15:15:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11900554

Quote:

Originally Posted by xetroV

Video evidence suggests at least the leading edge devices were extended:

https://youtu.be/oUFS2np0mKc?si=0f1Td6bQiqNOE4U-

LE devices extended on impact would correspond with the B787 auto-gap function that extends the slats in certain low-speed high AOA conditions for stall protection (aka "Autoslats"). Which this aircraft most certainly was in before impact.

Only to say, that LE devices seen extended on the crash a/c don't prove configuration on takeoff.

B777/787 rated/current/active pilot.

B787 FCOM:

Quote:

The slat autogap function is only available in primary mode when the slats are in the middle position and the airspeed is below 225 KIAS. At a high angle of attack, autogap fully extends the slats to increase the wing camber, thus increasing the lift and margin to stall. The slats return to the middle position after the angle of attack decreases. The autogap trip threshold is a function of AOA, airspeed and flap position.

Last edited by T28B; 13th June 2025 at 17:58 . Reason: Formatting assistance

Subjects FCOM

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Tu.114 June 12, 2025, 10:24:00 GMT permalink Post: 11898928	You Tube The video seems to show the aircraft descending from a few 100ft altitude to an impact. The landing gear appears down, flaps are harder to make out. How does a 787 react to low speed? What are the protections on this type? Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
skysod June 12, 2025, 10:24:00 GMT permalink Post: 11898929	You Tube Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
DogTailRed2 June 12, 2025, 10:32:00 GMT permalink Post: 11898936	Quote: Originally Posted by Tu.114 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3SEjNFJU6M The video seems to show the aircraft descending from a few 100ft altitude to an impact. The landing gear appears down, flaps are harder to make out. How does a 787 react to low speed? What are the protections on this type? Not video, shows a live feed? Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
Porto Pete June 12, 2025, 11:24:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899028	Quote: Originally Posted by Matt2725 https://x.com/krok7517100/status/1933089931347345596 That very much sounds like the RAT is deployed as the aircraft goes by the camera. The noise certainly matches " target="_blank"> The noise certainly matches Hard to say and the noise could be a fake. It's hard to tell what's real these days. Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
drdino June 12, 2025, 11:37:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899041	Comparing the sound at the beginning of this video: https://www.reddit.com/r/ahmedabad/s/Oz5hQzDiu5 With the sound of the 787 at the 1:14 mark You Tube It sounds like it had the RAT deployed? Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
fdr June 12, 2025, 14:37:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899220	Quote: Originally Posted by Porto Pete The noise certainly matches Hard to say and the noise could be a fake. It's hard to tell what's real these days. Quote: Originally Posted by ViceSergal [img]image.jpg[/img] Pixelation is a bit absurd, but that looks a bit like a RAT to me in the lower right. Quote: Originally Posted by CW247 Just for the record, there is no system on modern Boeing aircraft to prevent the accidental retraction of flaps when too low or slow when airborne. You wouldn't even get a warning on Boeing aircraft that is related to Flaps, you'd eventually get one related to Low Speed or Stall. The Airbus has a safety feature called "Alpha-Lock" which physically stops the Flaps from moving when the AoA or speed? is deemed too low. But that's not a safety net for all flap settings, just the lowest for takeoff. It will save the day in 95% of situations though Mr Boeing (hint hint) Takeoff config warnings and checklists may not have helped if the flap setting was not enough given the weight and conditions. A good handling pilot could recover from an incorrect flap setting (providing there's no obstacles to deal with), by gently lowering the nose allowing the airspeed to build up before resuming the climb. However, various human factors such as startle and over reliance on automation (my thrust setting must be good) will not help the situation. In order of likelihood: 1.) Flaps moved instead of gear 2.) Incorrect Flap settings and inability of crew to recover from that 3.) Double engine failure 4.) Some electrical event that distracted them TE Flaps are extended, flap gaps between the wing and the flap element are observable. This is not an aberration of the spoiler position, you can see the nacelles through the gap, and that means the flap can not be in the retracted position. An error of the TE flap deployed position, say between flaps 5 or 15 is not going to cause a stall event. The flap has not been retracted instead of the gear. Double engine failure... India. birds, always a latent threat. No rudder deflection, no aileron deflection, so it's not a SE problem, any engine issue is affecting both engines. Pitch control and roll is not compromised in the video. The crew put out a mayday, not sounding like an electrical fault or distraction. any funerals near by? Incorrect TO thrust setting would not present in the video as recorded. Low thrust results in low acceleration, and extended distance to rotate. after rotate, low thrust results in low climb rate, and can result in the crew over pitching where the aircraft has obstructions that the crew have to avoid. the video appears to show the pitch increasing at a point where the aircraft is already unable to climb, not the other way round. An outside possibility. For survivors, any from the aircraft will be a miracle, and mainly from the rear of the plane near door 3 area, if any. Plane is still striking tank traps at 70m/sec +, high ANU, it's not a high survivability event. Occupants in the buildings along the flight path will have a high fatality rate as well. This is going to be a high toll event in the aircraft and on the ground. Bad day at VAAH. RIP. Last edited by fdr; 12th June 2025 at 18:24 . Subjects Dual Engine Failure Electrical Failure Engine Failure (All) Human Factors MAYDAY RAT (All) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
Iron Duck June 12, 2025, 16:30:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899343	Although the CCTV video is of unfortunately low resolution the trailing edge discontinuity between flaps and aileron can just about be seen on the port wing at about 3/4 span, just as it can in this video at around 54 seconds in: You Tube Looking at the original video again the equivalent discontinuity is just about perceivable on both wings, so I was wrong at first and the flaps were not retracted. What appears to be the RAT quite possibly is; at that angle the nosewheel is completely hidden by the fuselage. Subjects CCTV RAT (All) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
Arrowhead June 12, 2025, 17:01:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899406	Quote: Originally Posted by SloppyJoe This is a higher quality video posted earlier. That is not two engines at TOGA and sounds incredibly like a RAT. I think most commenting about not hearing a RAT are watching the more widely shared low quality vid with very poor sound. You Tube RAT theory plausible IMHO Subjects RAT (All) TOGA Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
Old Boeing Driver June 12, 2025, 17:59:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899474	Quote: Originally Posted by Quantz Not in Paris region. Habsheim, in Alsace. An air show, you're correct. With the brand new A320. Air France 296Q You Tube Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
mikeygd June 12, 2025, 20:48:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899674	I've been looking at all the posts all day but don't think anyone has mentioned this. Anyone struggling with the videos on twitter/x or other sites that has Youtube can see them on VASAviation. He also explains the runway length/ADSB tracking on the ground issue . You Tube Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
slacktide June 12, 2025, 21:54:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899723	Quote: Originally Posted by Sriajuda You have heard AC with the RAT deployed HUNDREDS of times? The RAT is a last resort, when all other power sources have failed. All engines, the APU and (possibly) batteries on AC as the 787. Yet you have heard hundreds of RAT deployments passing overhead? Yeah, sure. There are people in the world who have a different, less limited lived experience from you. As noted in my profile, I live in the Apple Maggot Quarantine area. Specifically, I live in Lynnwood, Washington directly under the approach path for Paine Field's runway 34 Left, and I've been there since 2007. I lived in Mukilteo from 2000-2007, which is more next to the runway than under it. I also own and operate a small aircraft based at Paine Field and am outside on the ramp at least every other day. Boeing manufactures the 777 and 787 at Paine field. Two thousand, nine hundred and fourty-six of them have been made since 2000, when I moved here. The RAT is deployed and tested during EVERY SINGLE first flight of every aircraft Boeing produces that has a RAT installed. And sometimes it requires a re-test on subsequent flights. So yeah, I have heard a deployed RAT, from the ground, HUNDREDS of times. I've heard it while preflighting my airplane, I've heard it while mowing my lawn, I've heard while lying in bed. And this is exactly what they always sounds like. Another poster compared it to the sound of a T-6 Texan, which is really quite similar. You can find dozens and dozens of videos on YouTube of aircraft landing at Paine Field with the RAT out. It's not rare, it happens daily. You Tube Last edited by Senior Pilot; 13th June 2025 at 02:08 . Reason: Remove abuse of another member Subjects APU RAT (All) RAT (Deployment) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
CurlyB June 12, 2025, 22:01:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899731	Quote: Originally Posted by slacktide You are ignorant, and you are rude. There are people in the world who have a different, less limited lived experience from you. As noted in my profile, I live in the Apple Maggot Quarantine area. Specifically, I live in Lynnwood, Washington directly under the approach path for Paine Field's runway 34 Left, and I've been there since 2007. I lived in Mukilteo from 2000-2007, which is more next to the runway than under it. I also own and operate a small aircraft based at Paine Field and am outside on the ramp at least every other day. Boeing manufactures the 777 and 787 at Paine field. Two thousand, nine hundred and fourty-six of them have been made since 2000, when I moved here. The RAT is deployed and tested during EVERY SINGLE first flight of every aircraft Boeing produces that has a RAT installed. And sometimes it requires a re-test on subsequent flights. So yeah, I have heard a deployed RAT, from the ground, HUNDREDS of times. I've heard it while preflighting my airplane, I've heard it while mowing my lawn, I've heard while lying in bed. And this is exactly what they always sounds like. Another poster compared it to the sound of a T-6 Texan, which is really quite similar. You can find dozens and dozens of videos on YouTube of aircraft landing at Paine Field with the RAT out. It's not rare, it happens daily. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDZJYpe0uL8 Thanks for your input and a reminder to others manners cost nothing! You don't know who you're speaking to Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
krismiler June 13, 2025, 01:30:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899865	Here's another YouTube presentation. You Tube Similar to the Emirates crash following the attempted go around in DXB, momentum can be converted into altitude until speed runs out and gravity takes over. Quote: Yes. But I have not flown this scenario in the sim. Way too many protection to take off without proper configuration which leads me to believe loss of lift due to flap retraction. 1100 hr FO …….. Quote On the Airbus, if we take off in anything other than 1+F, I'm watching the F/Os left hand very carefully when I call for flap retraction. Last edited by Senior Pilot; 13th June 2025 at 02:29 . Reason: Both videos have been online here for many hours. Please read the thread Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
Sisiphos June 13, 2025, 01:53:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899881	Quote: Originally Posted by krismiler Here's another video taken from a different angle. https://youtu.be/2zi0HHGA4Ak?si=j3lVInUt1BFPQQZ8 Similar to the Emirates crash following the attempted go around in DXB, momentum can be converted into altitude until speed runs out and gravity takes over. On the Airbus, if we take off in anything other than 1+F, I'm watching the F/Os left hand very carefully when I call for flap retraction. If it was inadvertant flap retraction then they would have lived had it been an Airbus ( alpha floor prot, slats don't retract etc) My 2 cents: this accident will be a catalytic event. It will soon come to light pilots crashed a 100% working aircraft. Boeing and Airbus will present a near automatic airplane as a consequence very soon. This accident will be the gravestone for the handling ( and thinking) pilot. Last edited by Sisiphos; 13th June 2025 at 02:08 . Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
A Low End Private Pi June 13, 2025, 04:47:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899965	RAT Close-up Close-up of the RAT RAT Close-up 787 Subjects RAT (All) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
simon001 June 13, 2025, 05:37:00 GMT permalink Post: 11899986	Probably the best, early stage theory of the the cause that I have seen as yet. By a current 777 captain: You Tube Cutting to the chase, just watch between 11:00 and 12:05. 1. "Positive rate" 2. "Gear up" 3. Then the pilot not flying reaches for the flaps . If you watch the whole thing, the guy looks at two other possible causes but then discounts them. He makes the call based upon an analysis of the video. Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
lakedude June 13, 2025, 10:04:00 GMT permalink Post: 11900214	Quote: Originally Posted by simon001 Probably the best, early stage theory of the the cause that I have seen as yet. By a current 777 captain: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7EZkungFEE There is evidence on this thread that flaps were not the issue. The Mayday call and the evidence that the RAT was out is more convincing than a gear/flap mixup. Early on in this thread the gear/flap mixup had a lot of traction but after more photographic evidence surfaced it has more or less been put to rest, for me anyhow. Subjects MAYDAY RAT (All) RAT (Deployment) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
xetroV June 13, 2025, 14:11:00 GMT permalink Post: 11900504	Video evidence suggests at least the leading edge devices were extended: You Tube Subjects: None The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
smith June 13, 2025, 15:14:00 GMT permalink Post: 11900553	Just remembered this video of a787 with its RAT deployed. You can certainly hear it. A lot of people said you could hear it in the AI video but I couldn\x92t. You Tube Subjects RAT (All) RAT (Deployment) Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.
nolimitholdem June 13, 2025, 15:15:00 GMT permalink Post: 11900554	Quote: Originally Posted by xetroV Video evidence suggests at least the leading edge devices were extended: https://youtu.be/oUFS2np0mKc?si=0f1Td6bQiqNOE4U- LE devices extended on impact would correspond with the B787 auto-gap function that extends the slats in certain low-speed high AOA conditions for stall protection (aka "Autoslats"). Which this aircraft most certainly was in before impact. Only to say, that LE devices seen extended on the crash a/c don't prove configuration on takeoff. B777/787 rated/current/active pilot. B787 FCOM: Quote: The slat autogap function is only available in primary mode when the slats are in the middle position and the airspeed is below 225 KIAS. At a high angle of attack, autogap fully extends the slats to increase the wing camber, thus increasing the lift and margin to stall. The slats return to the middle position after the angle of attack decreases. The autogap trip threshold is a function of AOA, airspeed and flap position. Last edited by T28B; 13th June 2025 at 17:58 . Reason: Formatting assistance Subjects FCOM Links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context. The thread is closed so there are no user likes are available and no reply is possible.

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