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Also video of a massive smoke plume.

WWW

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If this can be trusted as accurate........

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The metars

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FR24 coverage (and any other ADS-B system) is poor at VAAH. Attached a 24h coverage plot. You'll note that the backtrack section of the runway has practically nil coverage, so they may well have backtracked but it didn't show up on ADS-B.

Subjects ADSB  FlightRadar24

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt2725

https://x.com/krok7517100/status/1933089931347345596

That very much sounds like the RAT is deployed as the aircraft goes by the camera.

The noise certainly matches " target="_blank"> The noise certainly matches

Hard to say and the noise could be a fake. It's hard to tell what's real these days.

Subjects RAT (All)  RAT (Deployment)

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Photos of VT-ANB

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SLF and enthusiast here. Not qualified to discuss flap/slat settings, but worth sharing a couple of shots of the accident aircraft at EGLL, obviously different wx and temperatures, but you'll get the general idea of departure settings for that location. The climbout shot was a July departure, the ground shot was a November 27L departure.

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Last edited by OntimeexceptACARS; 12th June 2025 at 12:06 .

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[img]image.jpg[/img]


Pixelation is a bit absurd, but that looks a bit like a RAT to me in the lower right.

Subjects RAT (All)

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Looks like they departed from an intersection. TODA from that intersection is only 1884 m. By mistake?

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Last edited by MyTH; 12th June 2025 at 12:56 .

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Flynn

The good news here - is it looks very likely that the recorders are in great shape. Does that open hatch indicate that they may have already been pulled?

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Not sure if this is of any assistance?

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Porto Pete

The noise certainly matches



Hard to say and the noise could be a fake. It's hard to tell what's real these days.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViceSergal

[img]image.jpg[/img]


Pixelation is a bit absurd, but that looks a bit like a RAT to me in the lower right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CW247

Just for the record, there is no system on modern Boeing aircraft to prevent the accidental retraction of flaps when too low or slow when airborne. You wouldn't even get a warning on Boeing aircraft that is related to Flaps, you'd eventually get one related to Low Speed or Stall. The Airbus has a safety feature called "Alpha-Lock" which physically stops the Flaps from moving when the AoA or speed? is deemed too low. But that's not a safety net for all flap settings, just the lowest for takeoff. It will save the day in 95% of situations though Mr Boeing (hint hint)

Takeoff config warnings and checklists may not have helped if the flap setting was not enough given the weight and conditions. A good handling pilot could recover from an incorrect flap setting (providing there's no obstacles to deal with), by gently lowering the nose allowing the airspeed to build up before resuming the climb. However, various human factors such as startle and over reliance on automation (my thrust setting must be good) will not help the situation.

In order of likelihood:

1.) Flaps moved instead of gear
2.) Incorrect Flap settings and inability of crew to recover from that
3.) Double engine failure
4.) Some electrical event that distracted them

TE Flaps are extended, flap gaps between the wing and the flap element are observable. This is not an aberration of the spoiler position, you can see the nacelles through the gap, and that means the flap can not be in the retracted position.

An error of the TE flap deployed position, say between flaps 5 or 15 is not going to cause a stall event.

The flap has not been retracted instead of the gear.

Double engine failure... India. birds, always a latent threat. No rudder deflection, no aileron deflection, so it's not a SE problem, any engine issue is affecting both engines.

Pitch control and roll is not compromised in the video. The crew put out a mayday, not sounding like an electrical fault or distraction.

any funerals near by?

Incorrect TO thrust setting would not present in the video as recorded. Low thrust results in low acceleration, and extended distance to rotate. after rotate, low thrust results in low climb rate, and can result in the crew over pitching where the aircraft has obstructions that the crew have to avoid. the video appears to show the pitch increasing at a point where the aircraft is already unable to climb, not the other way round. An outside possibility.

For survivors, any from the aircraft will be a miracle, and mainly from the rear of the plane near door 3 area, if any. Plane is still striking tank traps at 70m/sec +, high ANU, it's not a high survivability event. Occupants in the buildings along the flight path will have a high fatality rate as well. This is going to be a high toll event in the aircraft and on the ground. Bad day at VAAH. RIP.

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Last edited by fdr; 12th June 2025 at 18:24 .

Subjects Dual Engine Failure  Electrical Failure  Engine Failure (All)  Human Factors  MAYDAY  RAT (All)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by dragon6172

Not sure that is a 787 wing. Maybe from a different crash?

Registration, from what is visible, aligns with VT-ANB
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Golfss

it is quite literally imaged, and the fact that the 787 passing in video sounds nothing like a jet and more like a T6

Can't see anything

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Quote:

Originally Posted by ahmetdouas

Can't see anything

Need the full quality one mate. Also I believe at that angle the RAT is in line with the gear

Subjects RAT (All)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by ahmetdouas

Doubt it, let's see. Hope the info is released asap, they should have all the data very soon

Typical media already taking a dig at Boeing

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Deep breath... I wasn't convinced before, I am now. The RAT is definitely out guys. We are now potentially looking at a problem with the aircraft. Possibly a big one!

Subjects RAT (All)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by CW247

Deep breath... I wasn't convinced before, I am now. The RAT is definitely out guys. We are now potentially looking at a problem with the aircraft. Possibly a big one!

something I\x92m not sure has been discussed till now- doesn\x92t the 787 have an \x91early door\x92 function where the gear doors automatically open to improve performance? Even pprune has discussed this:
B787-9 LDG gear retraction
(That thread is illuminating in light of this loss for a number of reasons too)


in the video/images seen it doesn\x92t appear that the gear doors are down, does this further indicate an AC power loss?

(not sure if this applies to the entire 787 family though)

Subjects RAT (All)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by PTG5-61

If it isn't listed in the MEL then it can't operate the flight.

Without getting into how an MEL actually works, here's an excerpt from an actual 787 MEL.



AGCU = APU Generator Control Unit, VFSG = Variable Frequency Starter Generator. IDK what exactly the AGCU does nor why the left one is important.

Subjects APU  Generators/Alternators  MEL

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For those still under the impression that the takeoff or rotation was at the runway end... In the video of the CCTV camera you can see rotation happens basically behind the small structure in the foreground. Unless I am severely mistaken... Knowing the approximate rotation of the camera, one can simple draw a line until it intersects with both the structure and the runway:



Yes, it is just an approximation, but I'd say they still had a decent chunk of runway left, and not in any way close to taking out antennas on the opposite end.

So... likely not at MTOW, not using the full runway, normal rotation, followed by videos of it with RAT deployed which should only happen upon loss of all electrical/hydraulical sources, which should only really happen on loss of both engines without APU running, combined with barely (if any) sound produced by the engines in said videos... It leads me to form some sort of image of what happened. Could still be completely wrong.

I have done a RAT deployment test flight on a previous type, and even though I was prepared for it, it was still a bit of a shock to see the cockpit go mostly blank before reconfiguring itself. I don't know how quickly the 787 would reconfigure, if there is any downtime at all, but that would not have been a thing you'd expect at 100-200ft AGL. I do not know how many of us would quickly overcome the startle.

Subjects APU  CCTV  RAT (All)  RAT (Deployment)

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