Posts by user "Capn Bloggs" [Posts: 48 Total up-votes: 193 Pages: 3]

What, a takeoff warning horn? Seriously? There's no indication where the flaps were for takeoff .

Ridiculous. The jet's only been airborne a few seconds... do you really think they would have had enough time to shut down the wrong engine? Do you fly?

Maybe a dual flameout?

No, these jets are designed to fly on one engine after takeoff. With two running, a flap retraction and then extension wouldn't be an issue.

@FDR, you made a comment earlier re the gear sequencing. It appears that you were referring to the 787-9 (doors then tilt). The 787-8 is different, according to this post and this YT video:


In it, the -8 tilts the bogies then opens the doors.

Does the gear tip forward in this case? Because it's tipped forward in the crash aircraft.

Plane crash near Ahmedabad..

Really? What would you do when you realised you stuffed up the power settings for takeoff? Just sit there for many seconds and crash?? Of course not. You'd slam the throttles to the firewall, just like the EK 407 captain did. Even if you then forgot the gear, it'd still fly. And the Miami incident is a red herring because once the aircraft was airborne, it was always going to fly, because the takeoff thrust was correct.

They don't work in the industry then. What happens at your outfit?

I think they meant the retraction had "commenced". A previous post said the bogeys on the -8 tip forward, then the doors open. In the video, the bogeys are tipped forward but the doors remain closed.

Plane crash near Ahmedabad..
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The longer the regulators remain silent, the greater the probability that this has been caused by an operational error...

The funny/worrisome part about that is @Seven-Five said he is an experienced 777 driver! Seriously.

@T28, sorry, I wasn't questioning the "experience" of Seven-Five, I was questioning his comment about doing (and messing up) the engine failure drills with the jet barely of the ground, as if it was SOP for him or his operation. That's crazy. As for an experienced airline referring to bank angle as "tilt", I'll say no more!

Increasingly, the posts in this thread are becoming more ridiculous as time goes on. The hampsterwheel bearings will soon explode. IMO it should be locked.

It's interesting how good design ideas don't migrate between aircraft; I haven't flown the 777 or the 787, but in my last steed, the 717, at the bottom left corner of the PFD was the flap position, together with a little arrow that showed what they were doing. It was a simple exercise to glance there, when you told the PF to do something with the flaps/slats, to make sure it was happening (or not). The big one was when calling for Flap Zero. If you saw "Slats" appear, you would start yelling. I don't see such an indication of flap/slat position on the PFD on any 777 or 787 screen images I can find on the 'net.

While this didn't happen in this case, I suppose it is a good reminder to make a conscious effort to be aware of what your other half is doing. It's not difficult when you get used to it. As a side note, one outfit I worked for had a "Selected, three reds" response to "Gear Up".

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squawk7700

Perhaps?

Some questions, if I may:
When is the crew expected to do this? Wouldn't it be armed prior to commencing the takeoff so that it (one or the other) would engage automatically?

How does the 787 "manage thrust" after takeoff? The jet has only just left the ground; surely the throttles would be at maximum power and pitch would be used to attain and maintain V2 until the end of the second segment.

Are you saying the pilot( s ) just sat there while the ATS reduced the thrust (because is all it could have done, as it was at maximum for the actual takeoff).

Fixed on what? Or did it "decay" because the PF pulled the throttles back?

There is no evidence the jet climbed too steeply; I assume you saw the granular FR24 plot (from FR24 itself) which showed the initial flight path of this one was in the middle of the range, and the video clearly shows a normal initial climb and deck angle before "the @#$% dropped out of it".

So BOTH pilots just sat there, didn't pull the gear up, did nothing else and crashed it (pretty well, I might add, with superb pitch control right to the last second).

Interesting but totally irrelevant as the jet never got above 200ft.

You're clearly implying a complete ballsup by the crew, making multiple serious mistakes or errors of omission.

​​​​​​​Agree. Ban them, mods. Maintain Prune's high standard.

@Iccy , have a watch of this; start at 10 minutes.

I wouldn't be surprised.

The speed should be at least at V2 and probably higher. Why would the ATS not just hold that speed, albeit being a shock to the crew. Within a few seconds I'll bet the throttles would end up back in the forward position as the ATS says "hey, we're slowing down fast here!". It would be ugly but I can't see that the jet's going to drop out of the sky. The throttles aren't going to come right back and stay right back.

Have a look at the latest data from FR24 (from post 439 in the previous thread).

https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/f...rom-ahmedabad/

Yes, while there were other complications in play, this accident was caused by a single- throttle rollback after takeoff that wasn't detected by the crew:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TAROM_Flight_371

To my way of thinking, if you are in the habit of having your hand on the TLs, you're more likely to push them up when needed.

My comment was in relation to the scenario being discussed: a low-level level-off because the altitude selector was set properly before takeoff. And in any case, that Air India jet didn't look like it had climb thrust on as it topped out and started descending; it was pretty much gliding.

I wonder if, given the ADS-B stopped at the threshold, no data at all was recorded after that (including the crew firewalling the throttles)? Happened in the Jeju 737 prang.