June 14, 2025, 00:27:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11901024
Subjects: None
June 14, 2025, 02:03:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11901073
Flap/Slat Load Relief
In the primary mode, the flap load relief system protects the flaps from excessive air loads. If flap airspeed placard limits are exceeded with the flaps in the 15 through 30 position, LOAD RELIEF is displayed and the flaps automatically retract to a safe position appropriate to the airspeed. Load relief retraction is limited to flaps 5. When airspeed is reduced, the flaps automatically re–extend as airspeed allows. Re–extension is limited to the commanded flap position.
Subjects: None
June 14, 2025, 02:10:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11901077
Subjects: None
June 14, 2025, 02:25:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11901087
The aircraft has a system that can automatically retract the flaps to F5 in set circumstances. OP was supposing this system may have malfunctioned. That's all I will say.
Subjects: None
June 15, 2025, 13:14:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11902457
777/787 driver here.
Then the gear.
When you lift off the runway, the gear doors open REGARDLESS of gear lever position. If you do not raise the gear within 30 seconds, the gear doors close again and you keep the gear down as you apparently desire. In the video, the gear doors are closed again as the airplane flies into the suburb. This requires normal hydraulics in system C, which was apprently available as the doors are closed again..
Then the gear.
When you lift off the runway, the gear doors open REGARDLESS of gear lever position. If you do not raise the gear within 30 seconds, the gear doors close again and you keep the gear down as you apparently desire. In the video, the gear doors are closed again as the airplane flies into the suburb. This requires normal hydraulics in system C, which was apprently available as the doors are closed again..
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): Gear Lever
June 15, 2025, 16:36:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11902616
This yt video is somewhat cheesy, but it should make the -9 “early open” MLG door process clear to you, in a normal gear retraction. Unless you think this clown selected gear up on the ground.
They cycle open before gear is selected up (& even if gear is left down as you observed). Whereas on the -8 MLG doors will not budge until gear is selected up.
Last edited by Roo; 15th June 2025 at 16:47 .
Subjects: None
June 17, 2025, 00:12:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11903880
Aerospace101
post
makes a good point about the gear tilt. When jacking an aircraft with hydraulics off the trucks will often self-rotate with the heavier end obviously going down. Since the 787 truck position actuator is on the forward end of the truck it is probable that is the heavier end therefore the truck is likely to rotate nose down without hydraulics.
Subjects: None
June 14, 2025, 02:03:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11903883
Flap/Slat Load Relief
In the primary mode, the flap load relief system protects the flaps from excessive air loads. If flap airspeed placard limits are exceeded with the flaps in the 15 through 30 position, LOAD RELIEF is displayed and the flaps automatically retract to a safe position appropriate to the airspeed. Load relief retraction is limited to flaps 5. When airspeed is reduced, the flaps automatically re–extend as airspeed allows. Re–extension is limited to the commanded flap position.
Subjects: None
June 14, 2025, 02:10:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11903884
Subjects: None
June 14, 2025, 02:25:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11903885
The aircraft has a system that can automatically retract the flaps to F5 in set circumstances. OP was supposing this system may have malfunctioned. That's all I will say.
Subjects: None
June 15, 2025, 13:14:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11903886
777/787 driver here.
Then the gear.
When you lift off the runway, the gear doors open REGARDLESS of gear lever position. If you do not raise the gear within 30 seconds, the gear doors close again and you keep the gear down as you apparently desire. In the video, the gear doors are closed again as the airplane flies into the suburb. This requires normal hydraulics in system C, which was apprently available as the doors are closed again..
Then the gear.
When you lift off the runway, the gear doors open REGARDLESS of gear lever position. If you do not raise the gear within 30 seconds, the gear doors close again and you keep the gear down as you apparently desire. In the video, the gear doors are closed again as the airplane flies into the suburb. This requires normal hydraulics in system C, which was apprently available as the doors are closed again..
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): Gear Lever
June 15, 2025, 16:36:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11903887
This yt video is somewhat cheesy, but it should make the -9 “early open” MLG door process clear to you, in a normal gear retraction. Unless you think this clown selected gear up on the ground.
They cycle open before gear is selected up (& even if gear is left down as you observed). Whereas on the -8 MLG doors will not budge until gear is selected up.
Subjects: None
June 18, 2025, 09:17:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11905048
I think the minimum autopilot engagement height is a FCOM limitation but not necessarily a limitation of the system, i.e. you can engage the AP lower than that but it hasn\x92t been technically qualified to work in all circumstances, although it might actually do that..
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): FCOM
June 18, 2025, 09:44:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11905074
Yep numerous times in the sim over the years. Typically when overly exuberantly trying to get AP in after a V1 cut. RA is right in your face on the HUD & if you don't wait til 200' RA, AP will not not engage.
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): V1
June 19, 2025, 11:19:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11905941
The RAT is a small turbine that operates an electrical generator and a hydraulic pump.
“A ram air turbine (RAT) pump converts mechanical input power into hydraulic power for the center system flight controls. The RAT is in the right, aft wing-to-body fairing.”
Last edited by Saab Dastard; 19th June 2025 at 12:11 . Reason: Quoting deleted post
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): Generators/Alternators Hydraulic Failure (All) RAT (All)
June 19, 2025, 21:14:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11906379
Subjects: None
June 20, 2025, 12:42:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11906937
Unlikely to have tankered in fuel & even if they did they would still have had to uplift more. It would be normal to load the onward fuel in AMD having only flown in with what they needed for the short sector.. Would most likely have departed DEL with wing tank fuel only and an empty centre tank. I wont speculate here but I do wonder what works might have occurred in the 8 hour stop in DEL.
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): Centre Tank
June 20, 2025, 15:02:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11907040
If I may - going back to the upthread report of an Indian Express newspaper interview with "an official" who was pointing at possible "water contamination". This is very misleading by either the "official" or the newspaper. The incident specified by "the official" near Gatwick in 2020 is this one:
https://www.gov.uk/aaib-reports/airc...-february-2020
which was explicitly biocide contamination not water. As in the Japanese similar case discussed here already, the excessive biocide use caused chemical reactions in the fuel that - eventually - caused starvation and abrupt shutdown.
<snip>
So, some questions. If the investigators are looking at a biocide contamination:
- after such a fireball, would there be any way of determining whether the fuel had in fact been biocide contaminated? Perhaps the inner surfaces of the tanks? Assorted valves and piping along the fuel route?
- what relevant engine parameters are captured and (hopefully) usefully recorded by the FDRs? A couple of incident reports have mentioned monitoring of the exhaust gases, with an ability to detect contaminants as they are expelled.
- does anyone here know what records are kept regarding the biocide treatment at the point of fuelling? Iirc, in the Japanese incident it was forensic interviews with the ground crew responsible that revealed the details of the error, rather than captured hard data.
https://www.gov.uk/aaib-reports/airc...-february-2020
which was explicitly biocide contamination not water. As in the Japanese similar case discussed here already, the excessive biocide use caused chemical reactions in the fuel that - eventually - caused starvation and abrupt shutdown.
<snip>
So, some questions. If the investigators are looking at a biocide contamination:
- after such a fireball, would there be any way of determining whether the fuel had in fact been biocide contaminated? Perhaps the inner surfaces of the tanks? Assorted valves and piping along the fuel route?
- what relevant engine parameters are captured and (hopefully) usefully recorded by the FDRs? A couple of incident reports have mentioned monitoring of the exhaust gases, with an ability to detect contaminants as they are expelled.
- does anyone here know what records are kept regarding the biocide treatment at the point of fuelling? Iirc, in the Japanese incident it was forensic interviews with the ground crew responsible that revealed the details of the error, rather than captured hard data.
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): Centre Tank Parameters
June 27, 2025, 06:59:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11911701
A few days ago, I created a "wiki post" at the top of this thread, where I hoped we could collect "must-read" information. If you don't have the requisite 90 days/90 posts to edit it, feel free to PM me with what you'd like to have added.
https://www.pprune.org/recentforumwikiposts.php
https://www.pprune.org/recentforumwikiposts.php
Someone else created an external page a few days ago that indexed and sorted all the topical posts in this thread and the original one under major headings.
I can no longer find it. Did that get deleted by mods for non compliance or is it still around somewhere?
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): Thread Moderation
July 01, 2025, 13:22:00 GMT
permalink Post: 11914270
....the normal, accepted 787 Takeoff configuration is "Both sides draw from centre" if the Centre tanks have enough fuel in them. I think (maybe
wrongly
)
that
this
(prior few posts)
is the first time this exact point has been raised
. I hope I'm correct there. If not, my humble apologies..
Plane crash near Ahmedabad..
Plane crash near Ahmedabad..
Gets tiring correcting glaring errors such as the recent one wrongly asserting separate tanks for each engine is mandatory on TO or that it is routine to turn centre pumps on at 10,000'. Many of us just read it and say "that is clearly BS", "The person has not read the thread", then move on looking for some actual updated information, or news, while not speculating at all.
Subjects (links are to this post in the relevant subject page so that this post can be seen in context): Centre Tank